FATHERS  AND SONS

 

 

Words built around root B (b or v) or root P (p, v or f)

 

LANGUAGE

 

MEANING

WORD

with

B , V

SOUND                       

WORD

with

P , V, F

SOUND

Hebrew

GRANDFATHER

OLD MAN

א ב ס

SABA,

SABBA

Greek

GRANDFATHER

παππος

PAPPOS

Hebrew

GRANDMOTHER

OLD WOMAN

א ת ב ס

SAVTA

Hebrew

FATHERS,

FOREBEARS

ת ו ב א

AVOT

Greek

FOREBEAR

παππος

PAPPOS

Latin

FOREBEAR,

FOREBEARS

AVUS,

AVI

AVUS,

AVI

Hebrew

FATHER

ב א

א ב א

AV, ABA,

ABBA

Greek

αββα,

βαβας

ABBA,

BABAS

αππα

APPA

Latin

ABBA,

BABBUS

ABBA,

BABBUS

Old Indian

PITAR

PITAR

Greek,

Latin

πατηρ,

PATER

PATéR,

PATER

Spanish,

Italian

-,

BABBO

-,

BABBO

PADRE

PADRE

English,

Swedish

FATHER,

FADER

FATHER,

FADER

German,

Dutch

VATER,

VADER

VATER,

VADER

Modern

European

PA,

PAPA’,

PAPPA

PA,

PAPA’,

PAPPA

Hebrew

SON, SONS

ן ב,

ם י נ ב

BEN,

BANIM

Hebrew

DAUGHTER,

DAUGHTERS

ת ב,

ת ו נ ב

BAT,

BANOT

 


 

MAMA AND PAPA , MOTHERS AND FATHERS

Our hypothesis is that those words of the Table, that were not written in the Hebrew Scriptures , have not been newly invented at the reawakening of the spoken language . No book uses all the words of the language it has been written in. This is also valid for the Hebrew Bible . There are also several hundreds of words that occur only once in the whole text of the Bible.

 

As to the vastly sustained thesis of baby-talk as the origin of the words Papa and Mama , we should like to express serious doubts . We know that animals communicate by sounds and signs. Speech is a human " invention " made possible by the human speech-organs . Probably speech and speech-organs have developed together . Babies do not talk, until they hear others do so . Their words are imitations of what they hear. Children that have not heard people talking, don't speak . One may also observe that the first sounds European babies make, are not at all like "ma" or "pa", but more like " erre ".

 

Therefore in Similarity Hebrew 0001 (E 0663) we express the view that words for father and mother do not originate in baby-talk.

 

The sound M . It would , again as you observe , be indeed too far-reaching to derive the sound M from the sucking at a breast by a baby . It is not even the real sound of a baby sucking . So we would never think of doing so .

 

"Mmmm " is a very natural human sound already prior to the action of shaping words . It is only obvious that this sound then has been used to shape significant sound-sequences or "words", evidently by pronouncing some vowel together with the M . And there we have words like Ma(ma) , Am ( people ) and many others . We have mostly insufficient information to explain the original choice of consonants and vowels . But as to the M we know that it is found in a significant position , in Semitic and Indo European, in words that have some relation to the concept of " belonging ", "being together ", "being related ".

 

Similarities Hebrew 0140 (E 0026) , Hebrew 0027) , Hebrew 0141 (E 0560) , Hebrew 0142 (E 0455) and Hebrew 0143 (E 0456) , and to a lesser extent Hebrew 0144 (E 1025) , Hebrew 0145 (E 0582) and Hebrew 0146 (E 0583) , mention a number of words that have this M with the sense of togetherness, belonging or nearness .

 

We should add that not only in Latin and Greek we find cognates " amma " .

 

Also in Germanic we see :

 

Old Icelandicammagrandmother
Old High Germanammamother, fostermother
GermanAmmefostermother

 

German has the word "Ahn" with an N instead of M , for ancestor. Old High German has "ano " for " ancestor " with the female form " ana ".

 

SABBA . Words have an origin . In the case of sabba, indicating a kind of elderly or old "father" , we see an S plus a normal word for " father " . That makes us think of a prefix " S- ". Aseady remarked, written texts , even the Bible , do not necessary use all the words of a language. Especially a family-word may have travelled a long time without being written .

 

T E R   OR   T H E R

  • FATHER
    Wether the word parts or suffixes -ter , -ther, -der and -ðir indeed mean " looking after , caring for " is an important question. Until now no different convincing answer has been found. The Indo-European origin is seen as "*peter" or the likes, and this is then defined entirely as a root . It seems improbable that this is really the origin. The first part of " pater" , "pa" , means "father " in numerous languages but is then defined as baby-talk . We find it hard to agree to this and have tried to find an answer . This is shown in Similarity 0001 and the annexed Table.

     

    German has as well a word " Vetter ", constructed in a comparable way , meaning " cousin ". Earlier this word, in Old High German " fetiro ", meant " Uncle ". It is seen as having been developed out of the words for " father ", in Old High German " fater ". In Old English a " fædera " is a paternal uncle, but also a "godfather", that in German is a " Gevatter (OHG " gifatero"). The word for father is " fæder", that in plural says " parents ".

     

  • DAUGHTER
    The word "θυγατηρ, thügatèr " is rich in cognates in many Indo-European languages. In fact Gothic "daúhtar " and Old Indian "duhitar " show a wide spread . The cognates show variations in the initial dental and the main vowel as well as the second consonant, but are well recognizable . We know no indications of links of the first part to other words or roots .

     

    Or perhaps there is one, in Hebrew . There we have "דגה" , "dagà ", that means " to proliferate , have descendents ". It is used in Genesis 48:16 and indicates that many descendents will be had. It does not specify if these will be male or female. We have inserted this root in our List of Similarities with number E 0364 (Hebrew 0310) , comparing it with other Germanic roots . If we suppose that the proliferation of fish with their enormous shoals in the sea is especially impressive, also the words in Similarity number Hebrew 0309 (E 0408) may be considered as related .

     

  • ARATRUM
    This Latin word is sometimes linked to the problem of “-TER “ we are dealing with here. It is in Greek “αροτρον, arotron“ or in Doric “ αρατρον, aratron“, which according to Greek scholars are related to the verb “ αροω, aroo“ with the root “ αρο, aro“, perhaps an older and not quite correct theory. There are variations like “ αροτρευω arotreuo“, “αροτριαζω arotriazo” and “αροτριαω arotriao” . Some verbs have also figurative meanings, like to sow, to concoct, to beget a child. Anyhow they already have the same TR as seen in “aratrum”. Also Latin seems to have used some variations, like the noun “artrare” and the verb “aritrare “.

     

    The wordpart " -trum " might be not of Latin origin, but created on the example of Greek "-tron", as is the case with " spectrum ", based on the verb " specio " or " specto " with this special Greek-like suffix . This would narrow the problem to Greek "TR" but does not give a solution. Another Latin word is " monstrum ", but that has the verb " monstrare ", without a clearly defined etymology . And with " castrum " we are not better off .

     

    “Centrum” is a loanword from Greek “κεντρον kentron“ . This noun is based on the verb “ κεντέω kenteo“ or “ κεντω kento“, that means “ to prick “ in various senses . The “kentron” was a point or prick or goad . In the sense of the point of a ( pair of ) compasses it enriched the language by becoming the name for the “central” point of the circle described . That’s where our English “ centre “ comes from. But here we have the T already present in the original root, and only the R has been added visibly . We remain without explanation of “ –trum “.

     

    English “metre “ comes from Greek “μετρον , metron “ that says “ measure “, both as the instrument and as the result of using it . Oddly, we do not find for “ to measure “ a Greek verb with a root without the R , only “ μετρεω metreo“. And in Latin lacks a noun that would be “metrum “, but there are the verbs “ met-are ( active form )“ and “met-ari ( passive form )“, as well as “ metiri “, that all bear the meaning of “ to measure “.

     

    Upon analysing this information, one may conclude that the R in the various nouns may be compared with the typical R in Germanic ( English, German, Dutch etcetera ), that when added to a verbal root or form, mostly with an E for the pronunciation, indicates an instrument or person who realizes the action which the verb describes .

     

    To say it with reference to Dutch, we see : “meten“ = “ to measure “, "meter” = “instrument for measuring”, "meter” = “he who measures” .

     

    And then we find help from Old Indian or Sanskrit , that has the verb “ mâti “ for “ to measure “ and the noun “ mâtram “ for “ measure . One may conclude that these forms have no relation with the suffix ter “ as found in English “daughter” Of course Greek “–ον“, Latin “ –um “ and Old Indian “ –am “ are sister-suffixes for the shaping of nouns .

     

    We refer to the here attached number Hebrew 0569 (E 0576) , where Hebrew and Indo-European cognates for the concept of “ to measure “ are mentioned .

 

For cognates of “ aratrum “ we may refer to Similarities     Hebrew 0057 ar’à      E 0282

                                                                                                  Hebrew 0059 ara       E 0043

                                                                                                  Hebrew 0068 arets    E 0283

                                                                                                  Hebrew 0675 nayar   E 0044

 

All this leaves untouched our aforementioned thesis of the meaning of the suffix “-ter “ or “-ther” in respectively Latin and English .

 

 

 

 

 
Created: Tuesday 6 November 2007 at 22.30.54 Updated: 27/10/2011 at 13.53.20